Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

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rikuhelin1
Posts: 290
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:56 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72534Post rikuhelin1
Sun Dec 20, 2020 5:03 pm

Hi Margit,

Good potential lead to chase, leaves more like "Na". Got to agree about the head scratching lack of any strong spino influence on the leaves (and still hardy so far). A little stronger on the canes but not overwhelming. I am use to "fern - like" spino leaves, and extremely thorny (bristly) young canes on my spinos until aging reduces the "bristle fur" to a few annoyingly long sharp ones.

This was the first year it bloomed, and it did not repeat. Other than for a early yellow tint, and then a weak "green" tint, they stayed white until nearly spent or hit by water. I do not remember a fragrance of note.

I never saw an "eye" naturally exposed in the first year of blooms (8-12), should pulled one apart to see. It is in all day sun, except for the early morning.

This year was the first for developing real canes likely to be indicative of habit. They are bolt upright so far, meaning no real pronounced arching ... maybe 2-3 feet. I think I can cautiously eliminate some of the classics so far, but it still early days.
Riku

MidAtlas
Posts: 93
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:49 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72535Post MidAtlas
Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:57 pm

For what it's worth, the closest of known varieties that came to mind for me was 'Karl Foerster'. I don't necessarily think that's it, but maybe it would be something to at least consider if you haven't (though you probably have).

rikuhelin1
Posts: 290
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:56 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72536Post rikuhelin1
Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:50 pm

Hi Stefan

That’s another good suggestion - don’t recall planting one in that spot ... but that means pretty well nothing as recycle growing spots quite often and old forgotten roses presumed departed will pop up. . Have one in the back north gardens thats on it last legs ... though can’t say if cold or tree roots doing it in like with a Golden Wings (a favourite) in same north side garden. Both have not bloomed in years.

Though there is probably many roses with Na lancet “leaf form”. The best l can remember so far is Dr F L Skinner. Of course it’s not that rose - just convenient mine one is directly across from Na’s location - and produces some of the biggest seed packed hips - Altaica again with (Johanna Hill and / or Hazeldean).

Next year if canes hardy and blooms again l am going to do “rigorous” note taking and keying - no hips this year and if repeated it must be either “blocked” to pollinators or sterile ...
Riku

rikuhelin1
Posts: 290
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:56 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72706Post rikuhelin1
Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:36 pm

Confident nailed it.

... everything exact as can be from vendor's site description (likely a mix up as never order it) ... ironically, I actually ordered it in this year's import before I id it (definitely second being kept) ... everything correct especially notes on bloom character ... "green-yellow tones when young" ... saw that as clear as a bell and wetting susceptibility.

Name:

Flora Plena Svenski

Excerpts from vendor site:

Plant group: Pimpinefolia
Finder: unknown
Scent: strong
Color: white
Light requirements: Shade-tolerant
Hardiness: completely hardy
Petals 10-20
Height: 120-150 cm
Application: bushy, solitaire,

General:
Very beautiful, filled, white flowers with faint green-yellow tones as young. The advantage of this rose is that the flowers withstand better rain than the regular Flora Plena.
Riku

MidAtlas
Posts: 93
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:49 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72709Post MidAtlas
Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:07 pm

Hmm, that sounds hopeful(ish), but only 10-20 petals, can that really be right? They also give no indication of the rose being so different from most other R. spinosissima derivatives in looks; this one is so clearly distinctive in appearance (especially foliage/hybrid character) that you would think they might have given at least some slight hint about that, and not just compare it directly with the standard double white form of the straight species. I hate to say it, but I'm not quite convinced... have you contacted them to see if they agree that the photos are the same rose?

Stefan

rikuhelin1
Posts: 290
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:56 pm

Re: Scandinavian Import ID Challenge - Needle in Haystack Quest?

Post: # 72711Post rikuhelin1
Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:49 pm

Txs Stefan,

I never 100 % sure on any unknown rose IDs I make, but pretty sure I am close to 6 sigma on this one - too many pieces fit to be one of my tossed hybrizing efforts that didn't tray germinate in time versus my patience. The general description and vendors photo (former via "translator") fits this rose to a tee - including hardy. I will ask the vendor again, as before they said it was not one of theirs, apparently they have somewhere between 5000-7000 varieties in stock. Then it can only be one of my hybridizing efforts that escaped my over watering, or one of theirs that sported.

The site photo is similar for leaves (but no red edging border I noticed on young leaves - disappears), and drooping bloom form and arrangement of outer petals. No shots at my camera angles into the "almost double to sometimes nearly quartered" form of my example's young blooms. However thorn arrangement appear close. And the bloom descriptors "fill (full?)", and the both yellow and green tones (not dominate) color trait on young blooms and water sensitivity (though apparently better than type species), is bang on to my observations. They are what struck me as a bit unusual about this rose back in spring.

With second one, if it arrives as labelled, I will find out in 2 years if they are the same rose... then it is whether the rose is named correctly ... and that is above my pay grade for id'ing what I assume are uncommon roses in N/A.
Riku

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