Source for Condoleeza

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TimHAll
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:17 am

Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72543Post TimHAll
Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:30 pm

Hello all, Is Condoleeza available in the US for sale?

roseseek
Posts: 5218
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 6:54 pm
Location: Zone 9b Central California, Sunset Zone 15

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72544Post roseseek
Wed Dec 23, 2020 5:04 pm

It isn't on Burlington Rose's list nor is it listed on the Rogue Valley Roses site. They are the two sources with larger availability lists. Sadly, probably your best bed is going to be asking on rose pages on Face Book and some of the rose forums elsewhere on line. But, please be sure to be aware that sourcing any material from warmer areas of the country is VERY likely to be infested with Chilli Thrips. If you don't already have them, you do NOT want them. Good luck.
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

minutifolia
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:09 am

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72545Post minutifolia
Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:21 pm

Hi TimHAll. For what it's worth, the ARS local chapters in California have fundraising sales, usually in the autumn, where you can get your mitts on all kinds of harder-to-find roses. I've had a great time snooping around their websites, Santa Clarita and San Diego's to name a couple.

Hi Kim! You alluded to Chilli Thrips in an earlier response to one of my questions about moving to northern San Diego county. I admit your words sounded so ominous to me that I avoided thinking about them. I will do a proper internet search to see how most people deal with them, but I would appreciate your perspective. You may save some of us a lot of unnecessary grief if we face this challenge squarely. What do you do to manage this (previously to me unknown) scourge? Thanks! Brian

roseseek
Posts: 5218
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 6:54 pm
Location: Zone 9b Central California, Sunset Zone 15

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72546Post roseseek
Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:52 pm

Hi Brian, thankfully, I moved OUT of Los Angeles County to the very farthest point north in Santa Barbara County BEFORE they spread all over down there. I have witnessed them in the San Fernando, Antelope, Santa Clarita and San Joaquin Valleys on day visits to them the past two summers. I know those who treat their roses as once-flowering and allow them to be decimated by the CT's the rest of the year so they don't have to spray. They are at their worst in the hottest weather and seem to die down in the cold. I know others who take the lazy/stupid way out, choosing to only spray with Spinosad to keep biologic and sometimes organic, instead of using the cocktail of Spinosad and the stronger, inorganic pesticides suggested to prevent them from developing immunity against the single product. I've been offered many wonderful https://rosebreeders.org/forum/posting. ... tabsthings by many well meaning people and I have thanked them and refused for fear of importing them into my area. We are strongly agricultural here and CT's attack most ornamentals and many food crops. Hopefully, our cooler, coastal climate inhibits them from gaining a foot hold here. A number of articles will suggest using "IPM and organic controls" prior to resorting to the stronger, more toxic remedies. Except, the IPM is wiped out when you resort to the stronger pesticides. Tom Carruth, the Curator of Roses at The Huntington Library, tried the organic approach in the gardens there. They placed ONE THOUSAND packets of the predators for Chilli Thrips in the garden in one weekend. The squirrels ate EVERY one of them. By the time you notice their damage, you're already too late for biological controls. Their life cycle is complete in two weeks. Every two weeks of hot weather, there is an entirely new generation to decimate your plantings. Don't these scare the wits out of you? https://www.google.com/search?q=chilli+ ... 12&bih=842

Unfortunately, the largest and best of the rose society sales, CCRS, doesn't appear to have Condoleza. It isn't listed in their garden on HMF.
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

minutifolia
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:09 am

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72547Post minutifolia
Thu Dec 24, 2020 11:47 am

Kim, you are right. These critters scare the wits out of me. Grim. Thank you for the warning and information. Brian

roseseek
Posts: 5218
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 6:54 pm
Location: Zone 9b Central California, Sunset Zone 15

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72548Post roseseek
Thu Dec 24, 2020 11:52 am

You're welcome! I wish more would take them seriously. The spider mites can become nasty here, but NOTHING like these thrips. Imagine having to deal with these while trying to breed plants of any kind. Imagine just trying to enjoy gardening when they are there. They appear to leave succulents alone. I guess that's what I migrate to once they arrive...
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

shoy
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72550Post shoy
Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:02 pm

Re: chili thrips. I haven't seen them here in central GA, perhaps we get sufficient winter weather. Jacksonville, ST. Augustine, FL on the other hand have epic infestations. I haven't used any insecticides or miticides in the last six years or so. Perhaps this is a key to minimizing pest issues in my garden. The Univ of FL has done some research on using ornamental peppers as a part of an organic approach to minimizing chili thrips damage. I believe the study show that the peppers become a banker plant that attracts a beneficial pest that in turn feeds of the chili thrips. I don't seem to be able to attach the link. Google - Ornamental Plants as Banker Plants - Mid-Florida research. Stephen
Stephen Hoy
Singularly Beautiful Roses
Warner Robins, GA

roseseek
Posts: 5218
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 6:54 pm
Location: Zone 9b Central California, Sunset Zone 15

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72551Post roseseek
Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:08 pm

Which is great news...we have to determine just how much damage we're willing to tolerate before we go nuclear and use pesticides. Humans are the only predator in Nature which eliminates its food source.


https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 4412001818

https://mrec.ifas.ufl.edu/lso/BANKER%20 ... plants.pdf

https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... production
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

philip_la
Posts: 1078
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:28 pm

Re: Source for Condoleeza

Post: # 72561Post philip_la
Sun Dec 27, 2020 4:56 pm

Last year I didn't know what Chilli thrips were.

I had been monitoring my roses carefully for fear of Rose Rosette disease, and at the end of the season saw some curled leaves, but didn't give it too much thought once I ruled out rrd. That winter I read something about Chilli trips, and thought, "hey that looks a little like what I had," but the damage I had seen was quite mild. All summer long, in 2020, I never saw any sign of them, and assumed it must have been something else that I had recalled seeing while reading about Chilli thrips.

Throughout September, we had unusual amounts of rain, and my roses started putting on rampant growth. I also had recently planted some roses in very well amended soil. Those Roses with rampant, fresh, Lush growth, began to show symptoms, and by mid- October, I was really seeing indications of The Chilli thrips. Some of my newly planted roses have been really damaged.

It appears the thrips do not attack roses that are dormant, nor hardened tissue very much. The chili pequin is also native my area, and it is conceivable that we may have natural Predators.

I have my suspicions as to the origins of the beasts, but cannot confirm anything, and I have subsequently seen what might be thrip damage in numerous nurseries, though mild damage can resemble a number of other things.

I don't spray, and I'm not willing to start down that road. I am hopeful that next year is not going to be a much worse one than this one. It would appear that they have been in my garden for a year now, and perhaps the hardships that I generally put my established plants through prevents the thrips from getting too severe. Time will tell.
Philip F.
Zone 8 / Sunset Zn 30 (Austin, TX -- formerly New Orleans, LA)

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