Breeding plans for 2018

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dgermeys
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67384Post dgermeys
Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:39 pm

Plazbo wrote:But 2018 will see increased activity with
Lord Penzance
Lady Penzance
Hey Plazbo,
Have you tried to breed with rosa rubiginosa or it's hybrids such as Lord and Lady Penzance? I am planning to breed with it this or next year. Still have to buy a few plants... what is your goal here? Are you trying to get garden roses with scented leaves? Nobody every succeeded although I believe I have some idea (on the long term) for this. :-p But the future will tell. :-)

Very interested in your program!!
cheers,
Dane.
Dane from Belgium

Plazbo
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67387Post Plazbo
Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:02 pm

dgermeys wrote: Hey Plazbo,
Have you tried to breed with rosa rubiginosa or it's hybrids such as Lord and Lady Penzance?
I have seed from them but only at the beginning of when germination happens for me. Its been mentioned on here that rubingnosa seeds take more than a year to germinate too, so first results may not be til next year. Have done a bit of experimenting with OP seed to see if cutting into the seed speeds up the process or not.

Foilage fragrance on a more manageable plant is the goal. The meiosis can be messed with, possibly, I mean magnifca seemed to pass it paternally and lead to goldbusch > applejack (but i don't have access to any of that otherwise they'd be used too), theres a bunch of holes in that family tree though so its a bit of a guessing game. Im basically just breeding with glandular and as diversely as possible to see if anything leads to disrupting the meiosis or leads to passing via pollen and doesnt corrupt the scent too much, would rather keep things more apple/sweet than head towards woodsy.

Will just keep playing around with it, learning along the way.
Accepting/Looking for seed from, Coral Knockout, White Knock Out, Morning Magic, Alaska, Applejack, Goldbusch. They aren't available in Australia, anyone able to help? Thank you.

Warren
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67388Post Warren
Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:28 pm

dgermeys;

Lord and Lady Penzance have been around since 1894 and have no offspring to show, it might be a reason not to pursue this line of breeding.

mnemko
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67389Post mnemko
Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:54 pm

Thank you for the cautonary notes re supermarket minis. Might an acceptable defense be that the three varieties I've mentioned: Karina Parade, Gigi Parade, and Carmen Parade have very small foliage and short internode length. I am aware that the supermarket sells larger ones, usually in 5" pots rather than 3", but those are, for example, in Poulsen's Hit Series or Palace Series, and all of those have larger foliage and internodes. I also am of the belief that pot plants are grown without plant growth regulators (PGRs) so the size I see is representative of the size I'll get. Am I just rationalizing?
Marty Nemko
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510-655-2777

roseseek
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67390Post roseseek
Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:25 pm

I don't know. You'll have to try it and see how they work. Many of the ones I've used had no indication which series they were. Just color tags to show what color they should be.
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

Plazbo
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67392Post Plazbo
Fri Mar 23, 2018 12:07 am

Warren wrote:dgermeys;

Lord and Lady Penzance have been around since 1894 and have no offspring to show, it might be a reason not to pursue this line of breeding.

Possibly. I know Id be using different roses if the options where here. On the same token though, Greenmantle doesn't have any offspring listed either but there are people who've posted on these forums with results so it may be the difficulty of getting modern marketable features or extreme similarity the offspring tend to have thats resulted in nothing worth mentioning.
Accepting/Looking for seed from, Coral Knockout, White Knock Out, Morning Magic, Alaska, Applejack, Goldbusch. They aren't available in Australia, anyone able to help? Thank you.

philip_la
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67394Post philip_la
Fri Mar 23, 2018 12:59 am

Most of the smaller grocery store minis are probably parade roses from Aldershot. If you are fortunate, you can probably ID them at their site as one of the currently available cultivars. http://www.aldershotgreenhouses.com/pro ... ct=p7menu1
Note that they offer different cultivars for 4 and 6 inch pots. I assume it's a function of the size at which they finish with a full flush of blooms.

They have changed out a few over the last several years, apparently. I had i.d.'ed one I got a few years ago that is not offered now.

While it has never lasted for me, I did pick up another Lamy for $1 recently. We'll see if it survives or performs this time 'round...
Philip F.
[size=small][color=#669966]Zone 8 / Sunset Zn 30 (Austin, TX -- formerly New Orleans, LA)[/color][/size]

mnemko
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67402Post mnemko
Fri Mar 23, 2018 3:58 pm

What's current best practice for whether it's worth pollinating the first flush's bloom. A couple decades ago, conventional wisdom was that take rate is low and it's wise to wait for the 2nd bloom.

Also, what's current best practice for fertilizing females for the rest of the season after you've pollinated?
Marty Nemko
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mnemko
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67452Post mnemko
Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:23 pm

I am contemplating taking a no-labeling approach to my bgredding this year. It will enable me to make more crosses in my limited time as well as ensure a ready supply of the pollen best available at the time. Of course, when I harvest the seeds, I'll label the baggies with the name of the female, so I can see which females generate the best results. So given my breeding goal (healthy windowbox plants with red well-formed flowers), my male jar will simply be filled with the best red microminis sold in 4" pots at the supermarket, Trader Joe's or Big Box store. Sometimes, even within the same plant, some flowers have only 20 petals while others have 30. I'll take pollen only from the 30-petaled flower. What do you think?
Marty Nemko
mnemko@comcast.net
510-655-2777

Don
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67456Post Don
Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:08 am

An other factor to consider with supermarket minis is that some growers use growth regulating hormones to keep them small and promote blooming at a small size. The objective is the same as for growing poultry, you want get them to market quickly with as little labor as possible.

I tried a few Poulson and Kordes minis one year and the problem I ran into was apparent sterility. They didn't make it through winter so I don't know if that was a one-off or they were maybe triploid?

If you want a productive breeder for true minis then go for the Moore roses. Anytime has a good track record. I favor Joycie for the color but it's tender and not a prolific bloomer in my climate.
What doesn't kill them makes them stronger.

roseseek
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Re: Breeding plans for 2018

Post: # 67468Post roseseek
Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:33 am

It would be fun if some were triploids. Golden Angel is triploid and very fertile Two rather interesting results from it are these. http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.41312 http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.62359.1 Which is why I pushed it further with this. Golden Angel X (1-72-1Hugonis). http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.73883.0 Jim Sproul's L56-1 breeds like a fertile triploid and has successfully crossed with R. Minutifolia; Puzzlement (apparently Stellata mirifica X Fedtschenkoana) and Basye's Amphidiploid 86-3, the Banksiae X Laevigata cross. Golden Horizon is triploid and also mixed successfully with 86-3. http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.73858.0 But, so has tetrapolid Cal Poly. http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.73859.0 And triploid Lynnie. http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=2.73778.0 There are Lynnie X Minutifolia; Lynnie X Arkansana "Peppermint", Lynnie X 1-72-1 Hugonis, which is about to flower for the first time.

I have been getting significantly greater results using triploid minis with these odd things than I ever did with diploids and tetraploids.
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

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