Heart's Design

A meeting place for rose breeders.
chuckp
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Heart's Design

Post: # 66880Post chuckp
Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:27 am

Trying to develop some roses with deep red outer petals with clear white centres.
This seedling has Betty Boop as a parent.
Any suggestions?
Chuckp
Attachments
2018-01-21 20.15.58.jpg

jbergeson
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66881Post jbergeson
Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:05 am

Cancan and Never Alone come to mind. Hannah Gordon has a narrow pink edge.

Rob Byrnes
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66882Post Rob Byrnes
Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:02 pm

I can recommend Pink Meidiland.
Rob Byrnes

Historic Village of Roebling, NJ Zone 7a
On the right bank of the Delaware River

roseseek
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66883Post roseseek
Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:58 pm

That's pretty. Chuck! It reminds me of a Pookah seedling I raised.
april mooncrest x pookah (77).JPG
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

Jwindha
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66885Post Jwindha
Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:00 pm

Take a look at ‘Kiss Kordana’

http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.31175.1
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F62851A1-875C-4E70-8D92-74ECF2042AC2.jpeg
‘Kiss Kordana’ zone 8a

philip_la
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66887Post philip_la
Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:09 am

I don't know if you can hang a darker color on it, but Kordes' Dolomiti is purportedly extremely disease-resistant, and sets hips very well.
https://www.kordes-rosen.com/gardenrose ... miti?c=779
I'm not sure if there is a source for it stateside, but I'm planning on leaning a lot more heavily on the work of Kordes moving forward.
Philip F.
[size=small][color=#669966]Zone 8 / Sunset Zn 30 (Austin, TX -- formerly New Orleans, LA)[/color][/size]

chuckp
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66892Post chuckp
Fri Jan 26, 2018 7:56 am

Thanks everyone for your input.
I've been working on this for almost 20 years with some progress, but in all of my seedlings
the outer edge was not vibrant enough, more like a deep pink or bled into the white centre.
Maybe these goals are unattainable.
Chuckp

roseseek
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66894Post roseseek
Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:34 pm

It is attainable, Chuck. It depends upon the parents used.
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

pgeurts
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66895Post pgeurts
Fri Jan 26, 2018 2:41 pm

Chuck,
Dick Clark is red with yellow centers quickly fading to white. Being a grandifolia it's not winter hardy but it rebounds better than most. It also has good disease resistance for me. I've used it's pollen a couple times but didn't get many seedlings, though more to do with the the seed parents. Candy Cane Cocktail is more of a deep pink but it has Double Knock Out as a pollen parent, so it has good disease resistance. It isn't any hardier than Dick Clark. Blue For You isn't red but it has passed on the white eye consistently to it's seedlings. So crossing it with a good red might work.
Paul Geurts
Zone 4 Minnesota

jbergeson
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66897Post jbergeson
Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:34 am

I still wonder what Hannah Gordon would do if crossed with that first seedling you pictured.

I think the coolest, and maybe what you are after, is if the white center had a fairly well-defined edge where the coloration changed abruptly to pink/red. About halfway up the petal. So have we seen that phenomenon? I have had some seedlings maybe that showed something like that. One was an Art Nouveau seedling.

Ok, I found a pic of the Art Nouveau seedling, which has pretty much died, unfortunately. That's the one with yellow. The other one is another seedling that probably has not survived and I can't remember the parentage (duh, if I would have kept track it might have helped us.) It had a nice pentagonal white center. There is a possibility of it being a Hannah Gordon seedling, which would help explain why it hasn't survived.
Attachments
IMG_0563.jpg
Can't remember
IMG_1885 2.JPG
Art Nouveau x I Can't Remember

jbergeson
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66898Post jbergeson
Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:40 am

And I just re-read your post to see that part of your frustration is trying to get a good red color on the outside...my seedling pics don't help in that regard, but I thought they were kind of cool in how the colors are separated.

chuckp
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66900Post chuckp
Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:50 pm

Lack of winter hardiness is one of the biggest problem I've face in my quest.
Since I'm trying to achieve a rose with a prominent white centre, I thought a starting point with a rose without many petals would be a good idea.
Roses like, Gizmo, Hoot Owl, Space Odyssey.

Joe, your pics. demonstrate the separation of colour I'm looking for..
Chuckp
Attachments
2018-01-26 16.53.39.jpg
Not red enough.
2018-01-26 16.46.45.jpg
Good foliage, flowers, excellent spray, too magenta.
2018-01-26 16.45.44.jpg
Edge too pink, white undefined.

Jwindha
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Location: SC - Zone 8a
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66912Post Jwindha
Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:40 pm

I just saw ‘Hot & Sassy’ in the Edmund’s Roses catalog. That might be relevant to your goal:

https://www.edmundsroses.com/P/24748/Ho ... ature+Rose

roseseek
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Location: Zone 9b Central California, Sunset Zone 15
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66913Post roseseek
Mon Jan 29, 2018 10:43 pm

For that matter, Show'n'Tell may help.

http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.p ... 5738&tab=1
Kim
California Central Coast
USDA Zone 9b
Sunset Zone 15
Cooler inland coastal valley with strong marine influence

hoy127
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Re: Heart's Design

Post: # 66960Post hoy127
Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:52 pm

This seedling came from Seashell Sands.
Stephen
Attachments
14Seashell Sands seedling.JPG

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