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Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:02 am
by philip_la
Since winter is dragging on, and many of us are thinking of orders to place, and crosses to be done, I figured I would just solicit folks' thoughts on *their* best proven rose cultivars to contribute properties in offspring such as BS resistance, mildew resistance, hardiness, heat tolerance, drought tolerance, floriferousness, scent, mutability, deep (insert color here), etc., etc...

Yeah, I know, it depends on who it's mated with... Feel free to put in caveats.


Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:04 am
by philip_la
Oh yeah... I'm not seeing a lot of signatures on posts on this newer forum, so please include some climate info. (Not seeing my own signature on my posts... Hmmm...)


Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:11 am
by roseseek
Health, beautiful foliage and vigor: Art Nouveau; Lynnie; Pretty Lady.

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:26 am
by david mears
Philip_la, not to thread jack your post for to long, I have tried to add my signature in the past to no avail, I wish mine could turn out like Kim's.
I guess specific directions are need by me and some others so it can be done.

Regards David.

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:20 am
by philip_la
Kim, isn't it odd that a first gen. descendant of an HP (Roger Lambelin) would offer such? Art Nouveau is a beauty. And it almost makes me wonder if I worry about parentage too much when a (presumably) disease-prone rose gives rise to the likes of Art Nouveau. (I wonder what the other parent's pedigree was...)

I've seen folks post about Pretty Lady a good bit. (Anyone stateside working with R. davidii elongata, which seems to have potential to impart such health to offspring? Or am I presuming too much?) PL is another pink, but I might just have to look into her.

Yes, David. I agree. I guess I should at least fill out my location info so that can be seen.

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:51 am
by roseseek
What was written in the British publication was Art Nouveau is the result of some thirty-plus years of work along that line. I'm sure there are quite a few generations between nasty old Lambelin and Art Nouveau. Pretty Lady IS "another pink" and it isn't very double, but it IS fertile and accepts anything I have used with it. She gave a rather pleasing, more intense pink when mixed with Maytime and a whole range from nearly red and almost lavender to white when mated to Lynnie. She also accepted pollen from Fedtschenkoana and 1-72-1Hugonis, resulting in some rather beautiful foliage. None have flowered yet as they are now just one year old, but all are VERY vigorous. I can live with more pinks as long as they are vigorous, healthy and beautiful.

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:55 am
by andre carl
Based on Numbers:
Top 5 Mamas for me have been Prairie Lass, Country Doctor, Eternal Flame, Compassion and Blueberry Hill
Top 5 Papas have been Lynnie, Ebb Tide, Crimson Glory, Pink Princess, and Frontenac

Based on Health:
Top 10 would be Frontenac (papa), Indian Love Call (both), Prairie Lass (both), Eternal Flame (both), Pink Princess (better as papa), Country Doctor (both), Carefree Beauty (both), Cuthbert Grant (papa), Golden Fairy Tale (mama), and Golden Arctic (both).

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:35 pm
by Charles Calaforra
Florida - There are countless varieties I haven't tried yet, but for hot and very humid zone 9-10 areas these have proven to give some well adapted seedlings.

Old Blush- Old, a bit simple, and gets some fungus, but tough, indestructible here, and gives some surprisingly well formed flowered seedlings. Enormous number of seeds and seedlings both ways. Cross it with Double Knockout pollen and keep a fertile BS resistant seedling for future work.

Ducher - More fragrant and healthier than Old Blush, dense, well shaped plant, very fertile both ways. Cross with a fragrant more modern rose of your choice.

Darlow's Enigma - huge number of seedlings both ways, some will be very vigorous, healthy, and fragrant. Cross with something with larger flowers and fewer prickles.

Monsieur Tillier - gives some strong healthy seedlings both ways, could use more fragrance and thicker petals.

White Pearl in Red Dragon's Mouth - Red, cupped, good both ways.

Others that have given me good seedlings - Lion's Fairy Tale, Mother of Pearl

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:27 am
by johannes p
My pleasant surprise was a non serious cross that I made of Betty Will x Red Fru Dagmar Hastrup (sp?). I have found that red FDH is not as fertile as FDH and Betty Will is not the most fertile herself but I did 10 pollinations and all took with plenty of seed. I am hoping for a magenta/Betty Will. We will see, the seeds are still in the fridge. J

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:38 pm
by shoy
This past year Ping Lim's Golden Eye was very successful as a seed parent - great germination percentage. It is extremely BS resistant here in Middle GA. OP seedlings were various shades of red, red and white, pale yellow and apricot.

Re: Your best Mommas and Poppas for...

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2015 9:22 pm
by s_hardy
Here's a recommendation for a very small niche: fertile OGR seed parents.

My oldest project has been trying to breed OGRs. Damasks, Centifolias and Albas I was really unhappy with as seed parents, and some were also bad at producing pollen. Gallicas I thought were okay, and understood why most of the last hurrah (1825-55) for Damasks and Centifolias consisted of crossing them with Gallicas repeatedly. With the paltry specks of pollen some of my favorites produced, I'd want something more hip fertile than Tuscany Superb, or I'd never get it done, and for years I wasn't finding anything better.

Last year I tried a couple of new seed parents that are quite possibly related. One was Hebe's Lip, and while it was looking good, squirrels ate all of the hips off of it. The other was Saint Nicholas, which looks like it could be Gallica x Hebe's Lip. It has several selfings or other seedlings listed on HMF, and almost all are allegedly very disease resistant. SN itself never showed any disease symptoms for me, in an area where both of its suspected parents mildew. More importantly, SN produced far more (2.7x) seed than Tuscany Superb, with excellent germination and very few sickly or deformed seedlings.

In an old thread, Paul Barden said that Hebe's Lip produced seed "like a fiend" but that he'd never tried germinating any. Considering SN's resemblance to Hebe's Lip, I think that needs investigating, and will definitely keep the squirrels away from HL this year.

Saint Nicholas went out of commerce in the Americas when VG closed, but shouldn't be too hard to scrounge.